In this episode we welcome Jeremy Jenson, co-founder of DeadHeads, a unique, popular and groundbreaking NFT project working to build a blockbuster community-driven franchise.
Jeremy talks the importance of story, building the infrastructure required to create a successful animated series and navigating the challenging NFT market.
- Watch the DeadHeads Animated Series
- DeadHeads Website
- OpenSea Collection: DeadHeads; SkullTroopers
Speaker 1 (00:05): I think one of the biggest challenges is, is a lot of people when they choose your project, um, choose it because they think it's, it's like the easiest way for them to make money. Cuz they got onboard into the space, find new article that said they can someone flip the monkey for $50,000. They're like, okay, now I'll go flips, hang out. Um, so I mean a lot of those people aren't really in our community these days, but sometimes we get messages. Like I wish you hadn't released the episodes. Like it's like what? Like what, what, like not because they're bad because once we release the episodes, we removed a layer of speculation. Right? So, so a lot of people like who are speculators, like get upset with us, building the process out or making errors because they, well, you know, you're hurting my investment, but it's like, your investment is a part of our investment, which is this story, which needs to be as good as it can possibly be for us all to win together.
Speaker 1 (00:53): So it's, it's, it can be tough to, and also people go where's the marketing or something like that. And I think what they forget is that you pro has to be good and the marketing seems effortless for when it is. And so that's why we're working on our story a lot lately to make sure our story cause our stories, our products actually as, as good as it can possibly be. And that's why we're thinking and mark up all the trees while right. People to really just Reja it, uh, into shorts and then give the community more, say like sharper short, and then we can push those forward. I've kind of gone in a few directions here, but what I'm trying to say is marketing, uh, and all these things, uh, can give you hype. But I think an enduring franchise of any sort has to be worth participating in. And so that's what we have come to realize, which seems extremely obvious, but it's in, in a space full of hype. It's not
Speaker 2 (01:49): Welcome to story first, a podcast where we shine a light on the web three Mavericks that are leveraging the power of narrative to create immersive NFT world. We investigate the art and science of store or building through insightful interviews with creators, collectors, and investors. For those who seek a richer NFT experience, this is your portal to a vivid new realm of fiction. Story. First is a production of story. Prima doubt, whose mission is to encourage the growth and success of story focused and NFT projects through research, education and project incubation story prima brings you the blockbusters of tomorrow.
Speaker 3 (02:36): Hello and welcome to the hashtag story. First podcast, a weekly show where we talk web three NFT projects focused on story. Tell we believe story focused, NFT projects are built to last will form the foundation of a new breed of hugely influential properties in gaming entertainment and beyond the hashtag story. First podcast highlights the Mavericks and leaders who are leveraging the power of NFTs to tell the blockbuster stories of tomorrow. My name is Devin, so, and I'm joined by esteem co-host and co-founder Barry Donaldson. Barry, give us a quick introduction, say hello to the audience. Hello, my name's Barry. Uh, I am the head writer for or story prima and legend cipher, and I am very happy to be here today. Thank you, Devon. Thank you. My name is Devon Sawyer. Um, also part of story prima and legends of cipher story prima is a decentralized autonomous organization with a mission to accelerate the growth and success of story focused NFT projects through media research, education and project incubation. But we are not here today to talk about us or story prima today. On story first, we are most honored to welcome Jeremy from the Deadheads community. Jeremy, please say hi and introduce yourself to the story first audience.
Speaker 1 (03:57): Hi, I'm Jeremy. I'm the creator of Deadheads and I, um, I'm super happy to be here, uh, as one of, you know, the earliest guests on the show, uh, who, you know, a, a show and sort of a do I guess that's, that's championing, uh, stories. So this is the exact place I wanna end up. And this is exact things that I like to talk about.
Speaker 3 (04:16): Beautiful. Perfect. We've got some, uh, great questions lined up and we're really honored and pleased to have you Jeremy, to share your knowledge, your wisdom and your experience in the space. Um, let's start there with your, your project. Tell us, uh, tell us, tell us about Deadheads and your, and your role. There.
Speaker 1 (04:35): We're a hundred, uh, rooted in film. I had a, I had a knack for, for growth hacking some of these companies. So people would, you know, people were in Vancouver and Canada would, would love to bring me on. Um, and then, uh, my friend, who's an AI engineer knew that I was the guy who grew companies and, and uh, with, with marketing. So he was like, Hey Jeremy, um, I have AI, uh, artwork. Would you, uh, like to help me sell? And I said, sure. Um, I think that's a pretty cool concept and it's what talk about. So we spun up a website in our first month. We were absolutely killing it. We were doing incredibly well, uh, and NFTs were on the rise. It's about January last year. Um, so we pivoted the artwork to become NFTs and we ship everyone at physical canvas.
Speaker 1 (05:16): Um, and as we watch NFTs and really studied the space, it's became very apparent that, uh, web three and NFTs, I mean, web three wasn't word that was used. Um, but NFTs was, was just something that was pretty defining in its ability to add scarcity to digital assets and usher in this, this new kind of, uh, era, I guess, of scarcity in digital world. Um, and I thought what would be the best way to use an NFT? And, and I, I reached back into my experience and I thought, what would really love to do, um, and what would have a great narrative, uh, because narrative was really what took top shot, uh, to it ties back then because you were able to follow the games and participate. And, um, essentially we just said, let's, let's build, let's build the best show we can, uh, for the NFT community. And when we started to talk about Deadheads, we reached, uh, we re we started core with people. It was this idea of owning a character that would then be put into a show. Uh, and I think that was very novel and, and still is extremely novel. Um, and that is how we sprung our way into Deadheads and the greater NFT, uh, space as a whole.
Speaker 3 (06:23): Amazing. And when you think about you, you mentioned a couple key things around scarcity, the narrative, um, yeah. Loved the reference with, with, uh, top shot and the ability to follow that story. So, and then you've invented the character and put it in the story. So tell us about, um, how you view, um, character and story in the NFT market. Now, what's, what's your view on that? Where, where do you think things are going?
Speaker 1 (06:51): There's a lot that I could say on this. I mean, NFTs, um, and characters and stories are all I intertwined, uh, board eight when they launch, just put out a little paragraph, but of a lower, uh, and lower does kind of rule a lot of these projects. You see it even with Zuki, um, they have like a rather quality lore, but they also stand for something. Um, and, and I think that's that, that a lot of projects are relying on the storytelling. Uh, they're relying on web three as a medium I'm yet to be convinced that web three is in and of itself its own medium, or if it's a layer that benefits the mediums you already use, because you wouldn't talk about, you know, uh, NFT is having a unique algorithm like TikTok does that enables 'em to grow or, uh, a unique take on content creation like YouTube has over the years.
Speaker 1 (07:40): Um, it really is just this interesting layer to digitization. Um, anyway, so with that said, a lot of current brands rely on, um, speculation on what their lo could become. Uh, at deadhead, I went head first with the team and said, we've gotta learn a lot and we can learn a lot quickly and we need to start creating things to understand what people enjoy. And when you start creating things, understand what kind of, uh, demand there is for this niche that we are kind of trailblazing, um, for lack of a better term. So yeah, I think storytelling exists, but in different
Speaker 3 (08:17): Ways. Yeah, that's great. And, uh, I love that. Um, I wanna pull that string a little bit. Uh, there's two things I want to talk, dig in on, let's start with the, um, the speculation side. So, you know, we started story prima and the story, uh, first, um, media arm of story prima do to bring awareness to other projects like yours over yours has as significant amount of awareness on it. Cheers would to help those newer projects starting up. And, you know, there, we found that a lot of projects struggle in the marketplace if they're story focused because the market has so much expectation around launch a P P F P 300 bucks go to 3000, 30,000 board apes, 300,000. So, you know, there, there's obviously at a speculation side of the market that drives value in price and floor. Um, then we've got the story lower, heavy projects that are somewhat challenged with those market expectations. Maybe, maybe you could tell us a little more about how you've kind of carved a niche there with Deadheads and, um, or, or your thoughts in general around that view of sort of speculation market expectations versus making your story known to the market.
Speaker 1 (09:34): You, yeah, I think making a story known removes room for speculation on what the story could be, cuz you can kind of point to direct metrics. You can say our people aren't enjoying this episode and it kind of gives you a reason to think that perhaps these episodes, you know, I'm not going to succeed. Um, whereas we kind of see it as in order to deploy episodes, succeed, need underst exactly how, what it takes to build a decentralized team, what it takes to build a web three entertainment brand. And so we're laser focused, not on our viewership, um, but on how we're growing and our, in our abilities to story tell and animate and so on and so forth. I think pretty well evidenced by episodes is, uh, uh, an increase in, um, a pretty dramatic increase. And so the next, the next phase of our development is understanding what makes the great IPS great. And how can we make Deadheads IP incredible. Uh, the story is enjoyed by many and myself included, but um, in order to make a story that's widely appealing. Uh, it's asking a lot, but it's not a asking too much. Uh, I think it's, I think there's a lot of great IP and great stories out there. And I think what makes a good story, um, is, is findable and reachable and with where we're at, we're meeting a lot of the people who've done in the past and we're diving deep to find our story.
Speaker 3 (10:55): Love it. And you, you mentioned, um, a key term there that, um, uh, what'd you say just like create it and see what people enjoy. Tell us a little more about that in your process. What do you mean by that?
Speaker 1 (11:10): I think it's a hell a lot easier to release ten second trailer and, and, and picture of something than it is to actually build the infrastructure. I can build you, uh, an electric car to put on the showroom and get, take your money. You know, that's not, I'm saying like, as like, as society does, like there's a, there's, there's thousands of electric car companies, right? With one prototype that take people's money and then they, they say, now we're gonna develop the electric car. Well, that jump is incredibly hard to actually create the manufacturing process and the distribution on mass of the cars. In other words, when looking at things to speculate on it's very easy for a project to give you a trailer, it's very difficult for them to build the infrastructure required to release full episodes. What we focus in on is building the infrastructure required, cuz at the end of the day, that's where the buck stops. If you're building something for the long term, it's gonna require the right team and the right people in place. And that is not just gonna happen. I mean, you're gonna have to shift and shape and you have to pull, it takes, you know, many companies, many years to figure those things out. And so that's why I'm really happy. Our community's patient with us is we figure out what, what is required of our team.
Speaker 3 (12:18): Love it, Jeremy, what, uh, what is the infrastructure to you? What is it that you guys are building?
Speaker 1 (12:25): Yeah, so we have about 20 odd people. I mean, and, and a few of those are, are community people. So they're like head of operations, head of partnerships, head of marketing, um, and head of development. And then people below the head of development as evidenced by our adapt, which has a lot of proprietary entertainment tech as such that we'll dive into later. Um, and then on the, on the production side we have two producers. We have a few, we have multiple writers, they rotate, we have a, we have storyboards, we have a director, we have five plus animators. We have, uh, an audio guy. We have everyone involved with voice. We have the show runner who coordinates the voice, this stuff doesn't just happen, you know?
Speaker 3 (13:03): Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1 (13:04): Yeah. So we've had to build that out from ground zero.
Speaker 3 (13:07): Yeah. One, one of the reasons I was asking, like one of the goals of this podcast is to be is, is a, a, a teaching aid for, or anybody watching it. And so you say infrastructure and you know what you mean, but people like us included or anybody building your project, you, they hear you say that and they see your project. But if it's just, you know, John Smith from middle of nowhere, Kansas, he has no idea what it takes, even if he has a good idea. He doesn't know where to start so
Speaker 1 (13:31): About.
Speaker 3 (13:31): You're right. Yeah. No great question. I I'd like to definitely want to get into your, to the, um, infrastructure more. Um, and you talked about the entertainment tech, so I get a star on that, but I I'd love to like tell the audience, uh, for those of them who do, who aren't familiar with Deadheads, I'd love to just hear what is the sort of base story like what, what, what, what do you think gets the audience about the, the characters and the generative art?
Speaker 1 (14:00): I think conceptually, what gets people excited about Deadheads is that there there's no precedent for owning a character in a, in a series and what that asset valuation might be. If that series did incredibly well. Yeah. Or the supporting characters, there's very little precedent for what, uh, that would look like to have equity in it, entertainment, uh, brand, as it were or franchise is a better word. Um, and that's what I think gets people excited is, is, uh, a lot of people excited is that, is that, uh, concept. And that's why we build so much tech around it because we think that concept is so powerful. Now the vehicle for that concept is fortunately Deadheads, which are these cute dead characters. We sort of say, buy your soul and you can put it in an animated series if you wish, or you can just own the soul, put on your mental piece and enjoy the artwork behind it.
Speaker 1 (14:45): Like you do many other projects for us. Um, our story, uh, is adaptable and changeable and, uh, but our first season, um, if you'd like me to go into it a little bit was about a, one of the characters that was cast called Damien, who found himself, uh, in the purgatory between life and death. Uh, and he went on a series of missions in order to try and get himself freed from this per, but in the process of these missions learned a lot of values and a lot of things and people along the, from a lot of people along the way. Um, and, and that's without too many spoilers, kind of the overall big picture story of season one.
Speaker 3 (15:28): And so you, so obviously you started with, you know, the characters and the concept and, and I love the idea and I think that's central too. When we think about NFTs as a new way to, um, go to market, it's, you know, a Val valuing a digital asset, the ownership of it. So the community becomes a fan and an owner at the same time, but how do you get from sort of the, the cool concept and the idea to this infrastructure? Like what was the process for you and the team to move from really great art to this very deep infrastructure with these 20 plus employees or community members contributing?
Speaker 1 (16:06): Yeah. I think a lot of people sort of wonder, like, why you, why is this team the ones who brought this to market? I, I think, I think a lot of that comes from like a passion for disruption and learning and growth
Speaker 3 (17:02): Love it.
Speaker 1 (17:03): But I, who really knows, like NFCS are so unknown, like who really knows, you know,
Speaker 3 (17:09): What were some of the, what were some of the big challenges that you faced in, um, you deploying capital, getting the right resources, pulling a team together requires, um, significant amount of time, energy and leadership. What were some of the challenges you faced in building up to this, this point, which you seem to be able to scale?
Speaker 1 (17:29): I think, I think one of the biggest challenges is, is a lot of people when they choose your project, um, choose it because they think it's, it's like the easiest way for them to make money. Cuz they got onboard into the space by a news article that said they can, someone flipped the monkey for $50,000 and they're like, okay, I'll go flip so else. Um, so I mean, a lot of those people aren't really in our community these days, but sometimes we get messages like, oh, I wish you hadn't released the episodes. Like it's like what? Like what, what, like not because they're bad because once we released the episodes, we removed a layer of speculation. Right? So, so a lot of people like who are speculators, like get upset with us, building the process out or making errors because they're like, well, you know, you're hurting my investment, but it's like, your investment is a part of our investment, which is this story, which needs to be as good as it can possibly be for us all to win together.
Speaker 1 (18:17): So it's, it's, it can be tough to, and also people go where's the marketing or something like that. And I think what they forget is that your product has to be good and the marketing seems effortless when it is. And so that's why we're working on our story a lot lately to make sure our story cause our story is our products actually as good as it can possibly be. And that's why we're thinking and up all the trees, all right. People to really just re it, uh, into shorts and then give the community more, say like sharper shorts and then we can push those forward. I've kind of gone a few directions here, but what I'm trying to say is marketing, uh, and all these things, uh, can give you hype. But I think an enduring franchise of any sort has to be worth participating in. And so that's what we have come to realize, which seems extremely obvious, but it's in, in a space full of hypes. No.
Speaker 3 (19:13): Yeah. I mean, yeah, go Barry, when you say story. So when I say so when I say story, I think of fiction, right? Words, but stories are obviously movies, uh, TV shows, serials, um, and, and good art graphing novels also like the, just visual art as well. I can't draw out all. So I have trouble with that one. But um, when you say story, do you in your head, do you associate what you're trying to do with like good novels with, I don't know, good with breaking bad with the Witcher with good television shows, good movies. Uh, cause to me it's all kind of the same and a good, story's a good story. No matter the medium and I'm I'm of the opinion of good stories in the end went out. Uh, and I'm just curious and you kinda think of it in the same way.
Speaker 1 (19:57): Exactly the same way. And, and our, the way we deliver our stories by an animated series. But if it was by a book, a comic, a puzzle
Speaker 3 (20:15): Yeah. I've been thinking about the so NFTs are super new and it's just a new technology. It's a new way to allow for community engagement through ownership. Uh, I, I think, or we're starting to see it evolution of the technology where the NFTs can evolve. They can change over time while still remaining your sole possession. Like you still own it, right. You own the east, the NFT, but it can change and it can show, I, I think they will show, um, experience over time. So like a video game character, your avatar changes, you get awards, you get a scar, your hair changes, whatever. Um, I, I think those things will be interesting to see as a tech develops. Like it's still so new, like you said, but I think it will allow for more immersive, um, storytelling through individual involvement via like their emotional attachment to the thing they own.
Speaker 1 (21:01): Yeah. And when I first started the space, I, I, I actually thought similarly that like, these are stagnant images, all you gotta do is make it dynamic, be it, if you add accessories and then these will moon. But then I slowly over time realize that the stagnation of the asset is actually part of its value in that like a first edition Pokemon card is worth more than a third edition because it's it not, if you edited that first edition, then it would over then it would kind of like hurt its value in that, in that regard. And people are thinking of FTS. Similarly, I think as of now in that if you edited board apes, uh, the original collection, I mean, they would, it would hurt the value versus if you dropped new collections that, and let the originals be the originals, it like is to collectors at least, but NFCS are so dynamic that there will be tons of the type you're describing. There'll also be times that are like, that are stagnant. And I think both of those points have equal are equally valid and equally gonna happen.
Speaker 3 (21:54): Yeah. It it's interesting. I, I, I hadn't thought about what you said that makes total sense, but one of the things with a, with a physical card, if you change it it's so the, the severity is you can't change it and maintain its non fungible nature in the same way. But with like, I don't, I dunno, sorry. Uh, kinda lost my train of thought rambling there. So Devon, no, I, yeah, I, I love the conversation. I think the, the, the, the, the non fungible nature, the mutable, the mutability of the blockchain allows for scarcity of the assets. So the original assets maintain that, you know, it's like your comic book, one addition, one, you know, mm-hmm,
Speaker 1 (23:06): Yeah. Also clarify to anyone watching this. I, I, I flipped demo enough because it's a sign of respect in the underworld. It is not
Speaker 3 (23:15):
Speaker 1 (23:16): It is not me actually, you know, it, it's, it's part of building the brand. And especially in the early days is we were very counterculture. And I think something that we're gonna trend more towards is trying to find our feet in this way of reversing things that are otherwise negative into positive, such a step. And I think that's something that a sort of a trope that we'll look at, um, I would say a technical infrastructure, which is what you originally asked. Um, we, we built a lot of infrastructure. We put a lot of emphasis on development. I think tech, I think tech IP is, uh, quietly, uh, and in a lot of ways as valuable, almost as story IP, um, because what you're the foundations that you're building, um, may be used by the people. And if they are, then you're setting a precedent and if they're not, then they're setting a precedent you're able to follow.
Speaker 1 (24:08): So what we've been able to do cause we're early is kind of figure, think of how we would wanna do it without any sort of ideas, because no one had any, uh, cuz it didn't exist. So we built a few things. We built a casting pool, meaning if you want to get your deadhead into a show, you can just keep it on the side. But if you want, wanna get in a show, you you stake it, which is a defi term where you lock it up for X amount of time. Once you lock it up for that period of time, we are then able to cast it. You're basically signed an agreement with us and we're able to use your deadhead as a character in our show in return, you earn ecosystem token, which is frankly worthless outside of ecosystem at the moment called show earning show token enables you to then use the green room.
Speaker 1 (24:53): This means you can mint props and pieces from each episode. So unlike nutrition, automation, where the episodes happen and you move past them in this model, you're able to have pieces of the show themselves become scarce, digital assets. So to the staking and the casting pool and the green room, I think those two integrations will have some serious legs. And I think anyone's watching this with a storyteller and wants to know more about that. Honestly, feel free to contact us. Um, cuz I love talking through the intricacies of the tech, uh, and even, you know, if you, we might even be able to figure out how to, how to help you and your project use some of it.
Speaker 3 (25:27): Yeah. I was definitely a pause there and plug like it. I think that's for me the way, um, the way Deadheads has structured that idea, it's brilliant conceptually in that it really aligns with the storytelling nature, the uh, um, and pretty cool in that you can, you know, the longer use stake, your, um, your, your NFT, your deadhead, um, the more show you get. So it encourages, um, kind of giving the IP back to the community in a way that provides a return that also has an engagement function function. So as a, as a kind of marketer that that believes in, um, community building, that's why I came to web three, um, to do marketing here, that sort of community building has a level of engagement. I think that is bang on to how I see NFT products and communities buildings. So definitely check out, uh, the Deadheads website, learn more about that. Buy your fricking NFT, get involved, contact Jeremy and team through the discord. Um, you won't be disappointed at some, some brilliant tech IP, as you've said. And when you say the, uh, tech IP, you also mentioned earlier the entertainment tech, is that one in the same or is entertainment tech something different?
Speaker 1 (26:43): So my connection kind of came in and out there, but they're one and the same. Okay. Uh, when we're building tech for entertainment at the moment. Yeah. We're building tech for other like other implantations through, uh, GMI studios, which is our like parent company. Uh, and from there we have more things being built for other avenues, but with Deadheads it's our main, our primary focus is it's, it's the, it's the do all, it's the end. All of what we're trying to do there is just figure out this web three entertainment as best we can with Deadheads as, as the core.
Speaker 3 (27:17): Love it. Um, while we're, while we're talking about community and some of the technology you're, you, you're inventing essentially to engage the community. Um, tell us a little bit about how much, um, you know, cuz there's obviously engagement and then there's co-creation how much of your involvement with your community is, is co-creation do you involve the community and evolving the story? And if so, how, how important is it to your project?
Speaker 1 (27:44): We have interesting ways of involved in the community. One, we incentivize and reward engagement by an impact program, which we've developed. And, um, this basically means if you're active on Twitter, you're able to earn a series of rewards for being active. I think this is quite a good implementation. And again, we're trying to, we're trying to piece that all together, other, um, but moreover in the series itself, we enabled the community. At the beginning, we enabled the, to do everything. We hired an Emmy awarding producer who bought it at, we had writers from the community. We had, um, we had show runners from the community. We had everyone, everyone who did everything was kind of part of the community, which was the original ethos. And over time it, I think what it became this balance of, we need to reach an extremely high level of quality in order to onboard people who aren't already in the community.
Speaker 1 (28:36): And so to do that, we had to like lean on a lot of traditional means. So we kept the, we took the story, um, to a series of writers and we're trying to develop that different ways, uh, and try and get new premises and new lores and see with the short season, what lower could hit the best. Um, if you're in the community, you were able to submit shorts that we would look at and, and sort of rate and see if those could fit and produce the best ones. Um, if you're in the community, you're always, this is the most available one. You're always able to voice that. So there's a, we put some script lines out and if there's lines that yeah. And if there's lines that you think you could do really well and as a character that you relate with, we actually give you the ability to audition. Uh, and then, um, in soon we'll be sending people mics so that like we have real consistency for those actors. Um, yeah. So there's, there's interesting.
Speaker 3 (29:25): Cool. Yeah, that's certainly an area that we, um, with our project legends of cipher, um, continue to try and figure a way through, uh, you know, how do you involve the fans in the community as owners of the project, but also the desire for co-creation sounds like you've got some creative ways to do that, but I think the communities also really want to know that the product project they're investing in is of the highest quality. So I think there is an expectation on the leaders of the project to make sure that you're always pushing the limits and finding the best talent and bring them on board so that the, you know, our projects and our entertainment scales. That's a great story.
Speaker 1 (30:02): Yeah. We have a few professional voice actors, uh, in the, in the episodes. And I actually bet if you were tasked with finding out who they were without any context, you'd actually be able nail them all, which kind of speaks the fact that professionals are good at what they do. So community members having them sprinkled in as fun, but I could, you could go blindfold in these episodes and you could pick out the professional voice actors.
Speaker 3 (30:22): Nice. Well, that's a challenge for the audience. Go check that out.
Speaker 1 (30:26): Well, I mean, I'm not saying that the, I'm not saying that the community members to voice acting are are, are, are worse. They just don't. Uh they're they're they haven't done it as often. So they, so you can tell when someone's professional, because the way they execute the line, uh it's it's it's I don't know what is, but maybe it's the high quality is better, but you can tell very, very slightly, but the people in the community who do the voice acting are surely have a future in it. They would like, it may spend more time
Speaker 3 (30:52): That just speaks to practice matters.
Speaker 1 (31:02): Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:03):
Speaker 1 (31:22): And he's the recorder.
Speaker 3 (31:23): I know
Speaker 1 (32:02): Well, we, yeah, I mean, I, I, I truly believe that you have a good product. Uh, that's worth talking about that the rest will follow. Um, when I speak about that, my background, I more speak to technicals like SEO and so and so forth, which are actually more developed than the market we're in, uh, what really moved the space when we, when we launched Deadheads was a undersupply and, uh, sort of a demand for new and original ideas in NPS. And we merely presented the concept of a production around Deadheads and showed the characters. Uh, and, and we, we struck a chord with tons of people. We had great copywriting. We had a, we had an interesting, we had an interesting concept, uh, and people wanted to latch onto that concept. Now, now the rest of the job is to find, to make a story as good as possible and to figure out how we can make an impact against sort of all odds as your podcast talks about a lot, where there a much demand for profile picture. Um, so yeah, and, and games it's like games and profile pictures. Uh, it, it's tough to convince someone of the promise of Deadheads because no, one's done it before, so we'll have to do it. Like we'll have to make a story so interesting that every, that people start onboarding on mask and then there'll be a million Deadheads or someone else does it. And then deadhead is a, has a, has a better, has a better step to following. So it's, it's inevitable, but it's very difficult for the new investor to conceptualize. Why?
Speaker 3 (33:31): I think one, I think one thing on your side and our side and the side of creatives is the fact that there are functionally an infinite number of good stories, and everybody just wants more stories. So it's not like nobody can have a monopoly on good stories. So if you got a good story, people are gonna want to consume it. I mean, go, go to Barnes and noble, look at Amazon. Like all those places they're just full of good stories. Well, some are better than others, but anyway, my point is it's, I don't think that could ever be oversaturated if you can create a good story.
Speaker 1 (34:00): I
Speaker 3 (34:00):
Speaker 1 (35:05): It's a very difficult balance? I think a lot of it has to, you, you have to be, um, incredibly focused and you have to have incredible belief because even when other people are mad, because they got in for a different reason, if your, if our core thesis is develop a franchise worth being part of and allow people to collect souls and cast 'em, as they wish you have to be just deadly focused. Cause otherwise you're gonna get dis just, if you're not already in love with tech and, and storytelling, you're just gonna get disincentivized. Like, you're just like, you can get flooded out of existence. Like people be so mean to you that like, I get, like I, early days I got like death threats when B was running up, like it was crazy. Like it's so it's, so you really have to just be like, this is my lane, this is what I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (35:51): And you, you are even with us and, and God bless you. We are gonna do this or you're not with us. And that's totally okay. Cause that is your choice. Like I'm okay if you don't, if you don't wanna be part of the process of building like this, this entertainment space, web three Deadheads, like, you know, mission I'm, I'm totally, you know, I'm totally fine with that, but I really like that the people in our community is it's one of the strongest communities, in my opinion, because everyone is really well aligned that this is very innovative and very fun. And if you know, and the, the promise is is, is great.
Speaker 3 (36:28): Yeah, I'd, I'd second that, and, and if, um, you know, one of our, one of our co-founders, um, was on the call, he would echo he's the, the, the, the engagement from the dead heads leadership team and the community itself is, is outstanding. It is, uh, pinnacle, uh, and a best practice that should be followed. So again, if you're not already convinced, uh, through this call, you need to check out dead heads. Um, with that, I would like to jump onto maybe the last, um, question for you, Jeremy. And it's really around what's next for deadhead. Like what should the audience, um, who is already a deadhead fan? They probably already know from the community, but new audience members, what, what should it, what should everyone get excited about? And what's coming next.
Speaker 1 (37:14): Yeah, here's a look under the hood, as I've said, a million times, this podcast, when we think of dead heads and we think of why so much to be a part of it, historically, it was conceptualization. And that was where the buck ended. Know the last few months, it became very clear that conceptualization will only take you so far. It's about actually delivering a story worth watching and allure. While I enjoy season one, we are talking with some of the most incredible IP builders like that there ever have been.
Speaker 1 (38:07): We're gonna deliver the community. A couple of premises showcase by short think like chappy Neil bloom camp. It's like a little window into a universe, but we designed the whole premise behind it, see which window the community I align with the most. And then we double down with the team who conceptualize that to, to flesh out more and more of it. And that's how the season two and the lower will progress. It'll be a process of working with the community, working with professionals, store builders, world builders, and conceptualizing what could create Deadheads to be, you know, a top franchise, which is obviously our goal from day one that we are, um, fighting for every single day all day.
Speaker 3 (38:50): So you're, you're, you're kind of with the different shorts kind of pick what, you know, quote unquote theme, um, to pick go forward with. Right. Is that what don't
Speaker 1 (39:01): Understood? What people exactly, what people were like, we've written a whole premise. Here's like a window into that universe. Here's a theme, I suppose. What do you all want the most by consensus? Yeah. Boom.
Speaker 3 (39:13): That's cool. Um, so like humor versus action versus family friendly, or like different art styles or
Speaker 1 (39:20): More like in this universe, people die all the time and as people die, they come back as this and death is good because of this reason. And another premise might be, um, we are, you know, we're, we're already, we're already all dead. And, um, there's sort of a style battle to become living. None of those have, by the way, none of those premises have ever crossed my desk. I'm just saying like these two things yeah. Are totally different. And this one, the gladiator style might appeal to you more than the, uh, repeat, repeat of death. Like yeah, totally. Right. Makes sense. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:52): Yeah. So you're, you're, you're continuing on high quality building storytelling whereby you've got, um, concepts opportunities for your community to weigh in on the direction of season two.
Speaker 1 (40:09): Exactly. And, and I think what we're, we're not looking for necessarily consensus, which is a correct, said we're looking for the vote minority. I think if you put squid game to C as was evidence, it wouldn't be consensus, but a very vocal minority fought for it to go through. And I think you'd see the, like, you'd see the same with most, um, experimental kind of things. We're looking for a very vocal minority and we're looking for which, uh, which statistically is the most enjoyed.
Speaker 3 (40:34): What's your amazing your thousand true fans.
Speaker 1 (40:36): Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (40:38): Totally love it. All right, Jeremy, we've got, uh, two last standard, uh, questions from story first that we want to drop on you before we close out here, uh, NFTs fat or enduring
Speaker 1 (40:52): Fad.
Speaker 3 (40:58): I think, I think we all are. What for you, what for you, I mean, uh, come full circle, cuz you mentioned beginning, but what, what for you, um, makes NFTs and enduring, uh, distribution mechanism if we can call it that.
Speaker 1 (41:10): Yeah. I don't know if I would call it distribution mechanism. Yeah. But I, but an onboarding mechanism perhaps like, like distribution would mean, you know, that there were, that you were using the N Ft community to grow larger. Whereas I think the NFT community is crying out for more people to enter it. Um, we're kind of crying out for mass adoption. Uh, and, and, and again, like I said earlier, I'm not, I'm not entirely sure it's a medium for, for, I'm not sure if it's a medium in and of itself. Um, although it is being treated as one and maybe it is, and, and I dunno, no one knows either way, but uh, why do I think it's enduring?
Speaker 1 (41:44): Why do I think it's incredible? I think it's because there was never, there was never an opportunity to, uh, Ize. I think digital, uh, in the way a, that we are now, uh, on a small scale and the way that we're unlocking equity and entertainment, the way other people are unlocking community network as a value is unheard of. And what is a community that's worth a ton of money is value. Unheard of. Like, we just don't know, like is that's not traded on the exchange, you know? So what is the network value of a group of people we'll find out
Speaker 3 (42:20): Thats a lot.
Speaker 1 (42:22):
Speaker 3 (42:22): Yeah, I think it's the, everything of everything. Um, second, sorry, Brett. Kurt. You wanna jump in there? No, no, go ahead. Go ahead. Second question. How long do you think before a Dow accepts an academy award, Emmy Grammy, or some other mainstream, um, award
Speaker 1 (42:46): Three years. I like that you said how long as if it's inevitability and I would agree as well. We talk with, uh, a lot of people in the space. Uh, I, I know you do too. And I think there's a desire to leverage the sort of infrastructure that a Dow brings into the creative world. Uh, and so I would say like three years, I really do believe in that
Speaker 3 (43:07): Amazing. There are so many brilliant people and there's so much capital flying around and there's so much passion for this tech that it's, it's just, I mean, it seems like the, one of the things that's missing is the creative arm of, of the blockchain web three. And it's being built by people like you and the dead tech community and spice style and Huxley and the, any other like good pro any other projects for my name. But yeah, I would also agree it's inevitable.
Speaker 1 (43:32): Yeah. Yeah. I, I mean, like, I'll be able to talk more than that. Cause GMI studios are like talking with a bunch of people, so maybe nice. We'll circle back on this interview and we'll, uh, we'll be the first to do it.
Speaker 3 (43:44): Well, Hey, you're if you're the first up there first nominated, please. Um, we'll get you back on this. We'll have, hopefully we'll have you back on the show before then, but please do, uh, remember us when you, when you get there. We'll certainly, yeah. Again, folks Deadheads, um, it's an absolutely phenomenal project. It takes story to the next level. It takes entertainment tech and, and, um, what was the other term? Um, the IP term I'm, I'm losing it, but anyway, yeah, entertainment, tech and all of it to the next level. So Jeremy, thank you so much for joining us today. Um, invaluable. So great to see, um, you as a leader, succeeding and really innovating in the space, um, and with story at the core, it's what we're all about and what we're here to talk about. So thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (44:30): Thank you guys, having me. You guys really know your stuff and it's, it's such a pleasure to talk to people about things I enjoy. So I can't thank you enough.
Speaker 3 (44:36): Appreciate it. Thank you. It was awesome. Thank you. All right. So that's the end of the show folks, um, uh, for those who haven't seen the last episode, you can visit story prima.io, check out the last episode where we talked out and introduce story prima and the legends of cipher. Uh, thank you, Jeremy again, and, uh, tune in next week for the next episode, um, where we'll have another guest yet to be announced, um, with that I'll say good morning and good night.